It's not about talking to yourself, the information is open and shared between the different instances of the laconi.ca software on each server. It's distributed all over! I can be in identi.ca, you can be in waveydavey.com, and I'll still get your updates and you mine...more or less
Its this week's new thing; and basically seems like a blogging server that connects to other servers. Now, what would make this better than the rest is being able to go mobile with it. Litereally setting a identi.ca server on your phone and then facilitating interactions that way. That would be something innovative and beyond what other socnets are doing ;)
Yes, you have to remember that it's quite new, I'm sure features will be added as time goes by. And because of its open source nature development may well be fairly fast.
"you have to remember that it's quite new, I'm sure features will be added as time goes by." This it the key thing to remember here; this is an extremely new service and development, i'm pretty sure, will continue. It just has a bit of a "fad" feeling now because of all the talk as well as all the Twitter and other social network addicts migration en masse.
Good point @BigEclipse. When the luster is gone, will it become like all the other social services; or will open source translate into something that makes consumer and business sense for more than just a niche crowd.
you have to remember that it's quite new, I'm sure features will be added as time goes by. - that's not a statement of confidence in the execution of a plan, its a statement of hope given current circumstances; which, as we have seen with FF, Jaiku, et al; doesn't keep the lights on in the eyes of those who want new and cool
I'm as much a fan of open source as anyone; but there are fewer oss successes than the interwebs make it seem. No oss project has made it big time without major company backing of some kind; and no product, oss or otherwise is successful without being simple enough to meet a legitimate need. From the guy who runs a web server on his mobile phone; what area of communicaiton does this service solve for more than a niche group of users that will make it what Twitter and others aren't? Its really a simple business analysis question; but one that a lot of these fads seem to miss out on, quickly.
Ed haha.. thats why theyve left out vid on the twitter/jaiku so far..but 5 sec audio clips would be interesting...in an infrastructure far far away that could support it...
"...will it become like all the other social services; or will open source translate into something that makes consumer and business sense for more than just a niche crowd." This is what i want to see happen and not just as an agenda for Open Source gaining more ground in the mainstream. However, by it being Open Source, i think it has unlimited potential as long as development continues. Gotta remember, not all Open Source projects keep momentum.
I'm not saying that being open source guarantees success, but I think it stands a good chance. I don't really care if it's the next twitter, frankly I hope it isn't because I hate twitter. The thing that makes it vastly different for me is the open distribution, and the fact that I can run it on my own server if I want to.
As I say, right now it's very new, but certainly worth keeping an eye on I think.
@arjw: It solves a very real problem, not necessarily of communication, but rather distribution. If Twitter goes down, there's no more Twitter. If a server running laconi.ca software or similar goes down, you could (theoretically, yet to see in practice due to it's newness) transport all your status updates over to a new server. Identi.ca is the first, someone set it up in http://foozik.com/ ....Identi.ca goes down permanently, I move my stuff to http://foozik.com/ and carry on
I think the exciting idea of Indenti.ca is Federation. Distributed microblogging and relieving the strain from one entity across many entities. I'm not sure I understand how the software behind Identi.ca works yet to know what the true future will look like. But I like the idea.
Just my 2 cents worth, but ... Yes, it is great that it's open source for the reasons given well in comments above. Ditto on the subject of improvements and features.
However, as you can already read there, most people are not familiar with open source etc. and could give a rat's a$$ ... The want something that works and has features. Blame them? Identi.ca will have to mature fast to not get slagged off all over the 'net and discourage people who could be positively exposed to open source. That they had to move servers soon soon show a distict lack of forethought.
@edythemighty They should. What is one of the "hottest" trends right now? 2.0 and microblogging. In fact, that's why they are doing this in the first place. Then add to that sites that have millions of $ VC backing having troubles even with invites and YES they should have known. Bad development and implementation should not / cannot be excused with a shrug, a smile and the open source excuse
The problem with running your own server at your own cost is that when things go wrong you're the one who is going to have to put up your own fail-whale graphic and figure out what's wrong. Laconi.ca gets interesting when 1: people start providing hosting like they do with blogs and 2: it grows a development community consisting of people who run servers and care enough to maintain it.
Most of the people who are jumping onto it this week will be bored by the end of the month and will certainly not be interested in getting paged in the middle of the night because the server's gone down or fixing obscure bugs.
Not so much open source excuse as just a plain project excuse. You're rightfully pointing out the meeeeeellions other projects get. Not every single project can have that much funding, not everyone can go and ask for a new round and get $$$$ for X new hardware etc. For a new service running as a pet project, they recovered, sure had to move, but they moved darn it! And are still up. That's more than other pet projects of guys looking to try the new thing can say!
@adewale I hope that community grows and it will be interesting.
@edythemighty True, yes. You asked "Does anyone really expect to get many, many users right off?" and that what I tried to address. They should, perhaps, have taken "baby steps".
The real issue I have with this new product is not that it is open source, if they can make this a oss with a distributed service so that if you run it on your server would be a better option. If you have to transfer your status to a different server no one will use it except the people that know how to run a server. The main issue I have it twitter is using oss to run its service so oss isn't really the solution to this product. When you sign up you have to go to the server log in, and you should be able to see all of your status from one website. Updates should not disappear or just get dropped with out there being some type of error displayed.
I always jump on the web 2.0 stuff as early as I can find it since I host a show about technology and all of the new stuff out there. If no one can use the service and they weren't expecting to get the draw it got they should limit the traffic or display error messages. The first thing that really made me start thinking differently about Identi.ca as maybe not being a good product was I couldn't log in and received no error messages, so I emailed the support email address from the contact us page which promptly got bounced back as a none existent email address.
True even in twitters most broken state, when we ask for help the apps comes to life and somehow somewhere I get an answer to the solution.
Now with ping.fm I am finding that all of my other social networks are also bring more value to the interwebz. This brings my closer to twitter, jaiku, facebook. So far I have not found plurk and some of the other micro/social blogs.
It's falling over already for me, it's very very very slow today. But we'll see how it is over the next few weeks, it's currently suffering from being a bit over hyped I think.
Over-hyped and too-high, too-soon, expectations. i think it is suffering, albeit unjustly, from users being accustomed to using the other services and how they are set up in terms of usability.
Ah I just posted about this asking if it was down. I think you're right @big and @zenith it's early days and from what I can see the guy is running it off one server and trying to keep it going. I don't think he expected all this attention so soon. Open source really is the new black it seems. I wish him well and am happy to wait, not so sure about others
If others can run it and distribute the load across many servers it could be great, if I understand how the software is described I think that's the plan. More servers on the way I hope :)
I'm hoping that the idea of distributing will work in a way like BitTorrent taking the stain off one central point. People are writing plugins already so you can post to both Twitter and Indenti.ca I just think it's taken off with media coverage and hype a lot faster than the creator expected. I hope he keeps at it and finds some willing partners to co-host
What I've always thought would be good was to be able to use a microblog embedded into popular blogs as comments. This wouldn't work if you set up your own microblog but a feature such as Jaikus channels that you could have member posting and guest posting (using a Capatcha or something) would be ace. Maybe some open source guru could build that into Laconica/Identi.ca
Threaded comments for blogs I guess (ish). When people post links to a blog here and people comment it would be great if that was embedded back into the blog and "visitors" could comment as well.
@WaveyDavey001: What you're getting at is the problem a lot of people have with aggregators such as Friendfeed and our very own Jaiku, in that you can have several conversations, one in the originating blog, and one here, and the conversations don't necessarily carry over. What you're suggesting is a system that makes sure the comments are here, there, and everywhere, and that everyone's comments are visible to everyone else.....There's a few startups looking to fill that gap already....if I get what you're saying right
@bigeclipse Not really thinking about popularity contests really but trying to bring some of the services that people use together. It can be a bit of a pain sometimes when signing up to a service to try and rediscover/reconnect with contacts.
That's why I said a channel like feature, to avoid a look at me, look at me culture
@edythemighty: i think it should have been that way from the start... but it needs traction. it remains to be seen if something like identi.ca can garner it, but it has huge potential.
@edythemighty I actually think that there's value in splitting these conversations up. Imagine trying to have 1 conversation about a controversial or complicated topic. These conversation silos give us a way of saying I want to have a conversation about this $TOPIC with these $PEOPLE. That leads to fruitful conversation rather than a bazaar where everybody is talking past each other because they don't share a common context.
@adewale: That's where @waveydavey001's suggestion of a feature similar to Jaiku's channels can come into play quite nicely. Allow for formation of "club threads" where different subsets of people can talk, but keep it open enough so that if someone from Club B wants to join the conversation in Club A, they don't have to go through registration hell just to get in.
Still thinking about this and what I don't mean is a super cross poster.
I think to much cross posting is the technology equivalent of Landfill. Clogging up cyberspace, polluting search engines and hogging resource. Things need to be drawn together better not replicated everywhere.
I'm off to post this on Twitter, Pownce, Plurk, and of course Identi.ca now ;)
@WaveyDavey001: See, that's what i hate and would hate to see happen (and it think it is already in the works), cross-posting. If one belongs to multiple services why cross-post the same crap to all of them? Turns it into a dump and displays the desire to simply 'belong' to all these services without any real reasoning behind it.
I crosspost, and I'm damn proud of it. Sure, I may crosspost a lot of crap, but I also post original stuff to each service I'm at :3 Plus, I participate. Woot woot
Ok. So. Disqus+Jaiku. Disqus already has a thread for each blog post on their site. You can post to the thread there or on the directly on the blog, it doesn't matter. Take that and add Jaiku, a.k.a. starting new threads this way. Interesting. Got me thinking. Amazing thread this. As for identi.ca, "open source" has been the new black for years. At least for a (very limited) group. It's that thing which you know has huge potential yet isn't in the spotlight just now (and it's not been for years). Will identi.ca make a difference? Dunno at this point. But it is clear that the guy behind it was not expecting it to be this successful this soon. Which imho is bad. It's like..oh wait, I know - Twitter. For me, the deal breaker right now (well, except for the fact that I just can not log in) is the lack of threads. Why would I leave Jaiku for something with less features? We'll see what it turns into, obviously.
@bigeclipse I agree about the belonging. The mad rush to each service is annoying (particularly as I've already said I start to look for the same people which may say more about me perhaps)
@edythemighty Participating on each service makes you A-OK as far as I'm concerned (not that you need my approval). There is nothing worse than those that just spray their digital scent everywhere though.
@WaveyDavey001: Agreed. Only on Jaiku. Which is why, in spite of the fact that I'm spreading my digital scent everywhere, I only participate here. And Jaiku was the first microblogging service I signed up for.
Disqus is a comment(ing) platform for blogs. disqus.com. I'm not saying more, someone will at some point ask me if I work for them because I mention them so much. No, I don't. But I do like (and like to talk about) a good 2.0 service when I find one in this big ocean crowded with big whales, if you know what I mean.
Those who "spray their scent" are actually missing out. This is slightly heretical but if you go to every site and 'friend' exactly the same people then you'll get the same conversations everywhere. That's boring and pointless. Imagine what Jaiku would be like if every channel had exactly the same members. Ick.
The point of separating out into all these little groups is that you have different conversations and look at different facets of the same thing. @WaveyDavey001 is right that it's the particular people in a particular place who make certain kinds of conversations possible or impossible. I'd hate to lose that.
I really wish Jaiku wasn't stuck in this frozen development state, there's so much they could do. Do fellow Jaikuers think that development has stagnated because the founders won't see any any more money from it (and so they don't try as hard to innovate)?
I find it hard to understand why we're not seeing new features every week.. (and no, I don't think the App Engine port is going to change a thing, it might mean we see less of the bird... but I didn't expect to see a bird in the first place)
@aksyn - Having spoken to @jyri a few times and also having been party to a number of conversations around this subject.. It seems to me that they are moving onto bigger/better(?) things..
Speaking to @jyri post-google buy-out is like speaking to someone who has been shown the future.. And I really don't throw the term around lightly.. Really.
You can either feed your (small) family today or you can feed the world, forever, tomorrow.
What would you do? @jyri, as you all know, is one of my few industry heroes.. And yet even I have a moment of sadness when I see how Jaiku has, for want of a better term, squandered. Potential? Bucketloads. Investment? Zero.
We wait, in hope, for the time when all will be well.. But for now? Let us waste..
Let this not however, detract from the work that is being done right now, as we speak. Yeah Jaiku has been left in the corner like johnny no mates.. But those same conversations have implied a greater good. A future where 'social themes' and 'owning your data' actually mean something.
The future looks good. But unfortunately the future is not today.
I asked the founder a long time ago what the plan was post buy-out. The thread got bumped and bumped again.. And yet still we didn't really get anything. The users need more.
I need more.
How do I know? Well for a start a wrote all of this on my N95 using T9. That's passion. Right there.
@whatleydude: yeh, but anyone who's met you knows that /you/ can write all that in about 3 seconds with T9 ;) Good points, I just hope the Jaiku community hasn't disbanded by the time this fabled "son of Jaiku" turns up.
Do we, as a community, hope and pray for a successor.. Or do we just lay in wait.. Gormless.. Until we get plurked or whatever.
Remember.. We are closer to the future than most of everyone we know. And yet still we cry we are hungry. We.. Us.. Those that bear the name 'early adoptor' or 'evangelist'.. You. You are the ones that are carving out this digital/social/online revolution.. We discover what's wrong now so that those that follow after us may tread without fear.
@whatleydude: Trust me, I know. But I still can't help desiring (or perhaps demanding) more. The hunger never goes away. You know how it is. But is there anything we can do except pray and wait? Sadly I see no VC standing next to me.
I''m very sad about the current state of Jaiku. Of all the microblogging sites, this is the one I've been the most passionate about. It pains me to see it neglected when there is so much potential. But you have some very good points @whatleydude, those of us caught up in all of this innovation tend to forget that it doesn't even exist yet for most of the world. I think it's just so much a part of my (mostly) daily routine now that I think everyone does it when that obviously isn't the case. :)
I like threads like this, and i think it's a shame that most development happens in a vacuum and is then it's pushed out the door with a "hey we built this, deal with it" - I like the idea of identi.ca, because those who use it, who listen to (sniff?) the ether, and who are able should be able to extend it themselves for the good of everyone else. and shouldn't a platform for social networking be built out in the open by a community?
of course there's always the possibility that many hands will turn it in a big steaming turd of a platform, with a million incompatibilities and insecurities... but it's worth a shot
There was a song in Romanian back in the day that had a line I love. It was something like "we live each day with one day in advance". Some of us here are probably months if not years ahead of the mainstream, but...I honestly don't care. I don't think that wanting something to work and improve is out of line.
I think sometimes people lose touch with just how long it takes to build systems. I've been guilty myself of saying to someone you should just add this little feature and it will be great. Then they point out how many weeks that feature will take to build and test.
People also have this sense that any system which isn't constantly changing is being neglected. However once your system uses more 1 machine you're likely to find that it takes constant effort just to keep the whole thing running. Ask the Twitter guys or anybody who works in Operations and they'll tell you the same thing.
This is why one of the things that has always impressed me about the Jaiku guys is the remarkable level of transparency they've displayed about what they're doing and planning to do. For instance: http://mikie.jaiku.com/presence/39040029
Most teams would prefer to give other people the illusion that they're like a swan gracefully gliding over the water rather than show you that their feet are madly paddling under the surface.
Getting back to identi.ca, I posted about Russ Beattie's opinion on the source code (in a word: notmadetoscale) here: http://bvlad.jaiku.com/presence/39134264. I'm linking this here since I figure more people will see it. Great read if you ask me.
Well 1 day on and no one can really say anything bad.
Yes it got slow, yes it isn't fully featured and yes it could do better. But yes it is open source.
I love jaiku and I'm not planning jumping, (see other peoples threads), but this is Jaikus first rival. Twitter etc are no community at all, but I sense that people want this to work.
@whatleydude: Just re-read this and I still think a conversation like this can only happen on Jaiku, which is why I get a bit sad when people veer off to this weeks big thing.
So something may be the 'new black' today but Jaiku is Black and I'm hoping it won't fade and go out of fashion
@topgold: That really is interesting and something I didn't know Disqus would do. Are you sure that wasn't because you had clicked on the embedded wave itself?
Running that experiment has been interesting as I also learnt that there is threaded conversations in Identica now (shows how long its been since I visited).
It shows to me that Jaiku was really ahead of its time and that despite the enourmous popularity of Twitter people still want more. If those people just came back occasionally.
124 comments so far
Open Source. Run the software on your server. Help make it better by working on improving it.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
The software that it runs on is laconi.ca, which is open source.
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
So you can have your own private Identi.ca and talk to yourself?
What about todays features? As good as Jaiku or not?
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
Hope it's not just this weeks fad, I really want this to take off. It's all in the name of open source! :)
1 year, 6 months ago by zenith
For features take a look here - http://identi.ca/doc/faq Quite basic atm but I'm sure it will get better fairly quickly given the open source nature.
1 year, 6 months ago by zenith
It's not about talking to yourself, the information is open and shared between the different instances of the laconi.ca software on each server. It's distributed all over! I can be in identi.ca, you can be in waveydavey.com, and I'll still get your updates and you mine...more or less
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
Now I'm beginning to see the point
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
Its this week's new thing; and basically seems like a blogging server that connects to other servers. Now, what would make this better than the rest is being able to go mobile with it. Litereally setting a identi.ca server on your phone and then facilitating interactions that way. That would be something innovative and beyond what other socnets are doing ;)
1 year, 6 months ago by arjw
Not that far off...
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
Yes, you have to remember that it's quite new, I'm sure features will be added as time goes by. And because of its open source nature development may well be fairly fast.
1 year, 6 months ago by zenith
Ed.... 127.0.0.1 hahah Now you can turn on the webcam and talk to yourself....haha
1 year, 6 months ago by meonjaiku
@meonjaiku: I'm not giving you a cam show, if that's what you want :P
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
"you have to remember that it's quite new, I'm sure features will be added as time goes by." This it the key thing to remember here; this is an extremely new service and development, i'm pretty sure, will continue. It just has a bit of a "fad" feeling now because of all the talk as well as all the Twitter and other social network addicts migration en masse.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
Good point @BigEclipse. When the luster is gone, will it become like all the other social services; or will open source translate into something that makes consumer and business sense for more than just a niche crowd.
you have to remember that it's quite new, I'm sure features will be added as time goes by. - that's not a statement of confidence in the execution of a plan, its a statement of hope given current circumstances; which, as we have seen with FF, Jaiku, et al; doesn't keep the lights on in the eyes of those who want new and cool
1 year, 6 months ago by arjw
Yes, but they are not open source projects. :) I think this will gain a lot of traction if only with the open source supporters.
1 year, 6 months ago by zenith
I'm as much a fan of open source as anyone; but there are fewer oss successes than the interwebs make it seem. No oss project has made it big time without major company backing of some kind; and no product, oss or otherwise is successful without being simple enough to meet a legitimate need. From the guy who runs a web server on his mobile phone; what area of communicaiton does this service solve for more than a niche group of users that will make it what Twitter and others aren't? Its really a simple business analysis question; but one that a lot of these fads seem to miss out on, quickly.
1 year, 6 months ago by arjw
Ed haha.. thats why theyve left out vid on the twitter/jaiku so far..but 5 sec audio clips would be interesting...in an infrastructure far far away that could support it...
1 year, 6 months ago by meonjaiku
"...will it become like all the other social services; or will open source translate into something that makes consumer and business sense for more than just a niche crowd." This is what i want to see happen and not just as an agenda for Open Source gaining more ground in the mainstream. However, by it being Open Source, i think it has unlimited potential as long as development continues. Gotta remember, not all Open Source projects keep momentum.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
I'm not saying that being open source guarantees success, but I think it stands a good chance. I don't really care if it's the next twitter, frankly I hope it isn't because I hate twitter. The thing that makes it vastly different for me is the open distribution, and the fact that I can run it on my own server if I want to.
As I say, right now it's very new, but certainly worth keeping an eye on I think.
1 year, 6 months ago by zenith
@zenith: i too agree that it is definitely worth keeping an eye on -- why i created a presence there.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
@arjw: It solves a very real problem, not necessarily of communication, but rather distribution. If Twitter goes down, there's no more Twitter. If a server running laconi.ca software or similar goes down, you could (theoretically, yet to see in practice due to it's newness) transport all your status updates over to a new server. Identi.ca is the first, someone set it up in http://foozik.com/ ....Identi.ca goes down permanently, I move my stuff to http://foozik.com/ and carry on
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
I think the exciting idea of Indenti.ca is Federation. Distributed microblogging and relieving the strain from one entity across many entities. I'm not sure I understand how the software behind Identi.ca works yet to know what the true future will look like. But I like the idea.
1 year, 6 months ago by mjohnson
Just my 2 cents worth, but ... Yes, it is great that it's open source for the reasons given well in comments above. Ditto on the subject of improvements and features.
However, as you can already read there, most people are not familiar with open source etc. and could give a rat's a$$ ... The want something that works and has features. Blame them? Identi.ca will have to mature fast to not get slagged off all over the 'net and discourage people who could be positively exposed to open source. That they had to move servers soon soon show a distict lack of forethought.
1 year, 6 months ago by jpblogger
@jpblogger: Does anyone really expect to get many, many users right off? There's so many websites that struggle to get users....
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
So that's what Russ finally decided to do with Foozik. Interesting. Said he's very fond of that domain, had it for a while.
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
Right, read about it in Dan York's blog...
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
@edythemighty They should. What is one of the "hottest" trends right now? 2.0 and microblogging. In fact, that's why they are doing this in the first place. Then add to that sites that have millions of $ VC backing having troubles even with invites and YES they should have known. Bad development and implementation should not / cannot be excused with a shrug, a smile and the open source excuse
1 year, 6 months ago by jpblogger
@jpblogger: Right on.
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
The problem with running your own server at your own cost is that when things go wrong you're the one who is going to have to put up your own fail-whale graphic and figure out what's wrong. Laconi.ca gets interesting when 1: people start providing hosting like they do with blogs and 2: it grows a development community consisting of people who run servers and care enough to maintain it.
Most of the people who are jumping onto it this week will be bored by the end of the month and will certainly not be interested in getting paged in the middle of the night because the server's gone down or fixing obscure bugs.
1 year, 6 months ago by adewale
Not so much open source excuse as just a plain project excuse. You're rightfully pointing out the meeeeeellions other projects get. Not every single project can have that much funding, not everyone can go and ask for a new round and get $$$$ for X new hardware etc. For a new service running as a pet project, they recovered, sure had to move, but they moved darn it! And are still up. That's more than other pet projects of guys looking to try the new thing can say!
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
@adewale I hope that community grows and it will be interesting. @edythemighty True, yes. You asked "Does anyone really expect to get many, many users right off?" and that what I tried to address. They should, perhaps, have taken "baby steps".
1 year, 6 months ago by jpblogger
Private beta? :3
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
The real issue I have with this new product is not that it is open source, if they can make this a oss with a distributed service so that if you run it on your server would be a better option. If you have to transfer your status to a different server no one will use it except the people that know how to run a server. The main issue I have it twitter is using oss to run its service so oss isn't really the solution to this product. When you sign up you have to go to the server log in, and you should be able to see all of your status from one website. Updates should not disappear or just get dropped with out there being some type of error displayed.
I always jump on the web 2.0 stuff as early as I can find it since I host a show about technology and all of the new stuff out there. If no one can use the service and they weren't expecting to get the draw it got they should limit the traffic or display error messages. The first thing that really made me start thinking differently about Identi.ca as maybe not being a good product was I couldn't log in and received no error messages, so I emailed the support email address from the contact us page which promptly got bounced back as a none existent email address.
1 year, 6 months ago by terryjr386
@edythemighty: Don't give 'em any crazy ideas. XD
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
True even in twitters most broken state, when we ask for help the apps comes to life and somehow somewhere I get an answer to the solution.
Now with ping.fm I am finding that all of my other social networks are also bring more value to the interwebz. This brings my closer to twitter, jaiku, facebook. So far I have not found plurk and some of the other micro/social blogs.
1 year, 6 months ago by terryjr386
Well I've joined up. It is extremely quick in growth, so will be extremely quick to fall over. When it does lets not be too harsh eh?
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
It's falling over already for me, it's very very very slow today. But we'll see how it is over the next few weeks, it's currently suffering from being a bit over hyped I think.
1 year, 6 months ago by zenith
Over-hyped and too-high, too-soon, expectations. i think it is suffering, albeit unjustly, from users being accustomed to using the other services and how they are set up in terms of usability.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
Ah I just posted about this asking if it was down. I think you're right @big and @zenith it's early days and from what I can see the guy is running it off one server and trying to keep it going. I don't think he expected all this attention so soon. Open source really is the new black it seems. I wish him well and am happy to wait, not so sure about others
1 year, 6 months ago by dantheman
Lets all move to Twitter in protest :-P
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
If others can run it and distribute the load across many servers it could be great, if I understand how the software is described I think that's the plan. More servers on the way I hope :)
1 year, 6 months ago by dantheman
Yeah, i was thinking of running one, but am not sure i have sufficient time to dedicate to maintenance, etc.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
I'm hoping that the idea of distributing will work in a way like BitTorrent taking the stain off one central point. People are writing plugins already so you can post to both Twitter and Indenti.ca I just think it's taken off with media coverage and hype a lot faster than the creator expected. I hope he keeps at it and finds some willing partners to co-host
1 year, 6 months ago by dantheman
True. There is this: http://foozik.com/ Credit to @edythemighty for the find.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
@heavensrevenge mentioned it...and same as I mentioned that there's more out there....oy...but what a name eh? twoorl
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
Source for twoorl is here
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
Hmm somebody just mentioned Twoorl.com as well, that's open source too apparently
1 year, 6 months ago by dantheman
Doesn't Foozik clarify what I was saying in Post No 4?
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
(scrolls all the way up to post 4).......
1 year, 6 months ago by dantheman
Umm post 4 where you asked if this was as good as Jaiku? The answer is no it's not as good yet but hopefully it can be :)
1 year, 6 months ago by dantheman
@dantheman: Sorry I meant where you could have your own private Microblog and end up talking to yourself Foozik, Twooorl etc.
My dream of tribbling on twuntker (http://tinyurl.com/6mhgv8) may become reality yet :)
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
Tribbling? Hehehehe not heard that one. Yeah I think you can have your own personal site with the identi.ca software if you want :)
1 year, 6 months ago by dantheman
Unfortunately, the Laconica Web site is down.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
I downloaded it last night, not had chance to look at it yet though
1 year, 6 months ago by zenith
Maybe in that last contest i was in i should have done this instead. I already have the server running on my phone with a blog component ;)
1 year, 6 months ago by arjw
Crap. i know i should have done that last night. Now when i try to get it, no go. No sweat though, i'm sure it'll b back up shortly.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
@arjw: What? Already? Man. How's it been so far?
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
I downloaded the laconi.ca source as well...
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
Hey man, i'm starting to feel like a jerk here.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
What I've always thought would be good was to be able to use a microblog embedded into popular blogs as comments. This wouldn't work if you set up your own microblog but a feature such as Jaikus channels that you could have member posting and guest posting (using a Capatcha or something) would be ace. Maybe some open source guru could build that into Laconica/Identi.ca
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
@WaveyDavey001: Do you want commenting or microblogging? Threaded comments for blogs?
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
That would help to perpetuate the "popularity contests" that goes on on some of these sites now methinks.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
Yeah, that's kind of two different things really.
1 year, 6 months ago by zenith
Threaded comments for blogs I guess (ish). When people post links to a blog here and people comment it would be great if that was embedded back into the blog and "visitors" could comment as well.
Does that make sense? I'm just lazy really.
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
I have the mobile web server. I didn't mean to imply i was running this too. I need only one server to manage
1 year, 6 months ago by arjw
@WaveyDavey001: It's easy to become "lazy" when being pulled in a thousand directions at once.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
@WaveyDavey001: What you're getting at is the problem a lot of people have with aggregators such as Friendfeed and our very own Jaiku, in that you can have several conversations, one in the originating blog, and one here, and the conversations don't necessarily carry over. What you're suggesting is a system that makes sure the comments are here, there, and everywhere, and that everyone's comments are visible to everyone else.....There's a few startups looking to fill that gap already....if I get what you're saying right
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
@bigeclipse Not really thinking about popularity contests really but trying to bring some of the services that people use together. It can be a bit of a pain sometimes when signing up to a service to try and rediscover/reconnect with contacts.
That's why I said a channel like feature, to avoid a look at me, look at me culture
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
@edythemighty We must have been typing at the same time. I think you've got it exactly
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
@edythemighty: i think it should have been that way from the start... but it needs traction. it remains to be seen if something like identi.ca can garner it, but it has huge potential.
1 year, 6 months ago by aksyn
@WaveyDavey001: i see now.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
@edythemighty I actually think that there's value in splitting these conversations up. Imagine trying to have 1 conversation about a controversial or complicated topic. These conversation silos give us a way of saying I want to have a conversation about this $TOPIC with these $PEOPLE. That leads to fruitful conversation rather than a bazaar where everybody is talking past each other because they don't share a common context.
1 year, 6 months ago by adewale
@adewale: that's why we have threads..
1 year, 6 months ago by aksyn
@adewale: That's where @waveydavey001's suggestion of a feature similar to Jaiku's channels can come into play quite nicely. Allow for formation of "club threads" where different subsets of people can talk, but keep it open enough so that if someone from Club B wants to join the conversation in Club A, they don't have to go through registration hell just to get in.
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
Well, if nothing else, identi.ca is sparking some very interesting conversations. :)
1 year, 6 months ago by zenith
Still thinking about this and what I don't mean is a super cross poster.
I think to much cross posting is the technology equivalent of Landfill. Clogging up cyberspace, polluting search engines and hogging resource. Things need to be drawn together better not replicated everywhere.
I'm off to post this on Twitter, Pownce, Plurk, and of course Identi.ca now ;)
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
@WaveyDavey001: See, that's what i hate and would hate to see happen (and it think it is already in the works), cross-posting. If one belongs to multiple services why cross-post the same crap to all of them? Turns it into a dump and displays the desire to simply 'belong' to all these services without any real reasoning behind it.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
I crosspost, and I'm damn proud of it. Sure, I may crosspost a lot of crap, but I also post original stuff to each service I'm at :3 Plus, I participate. Woot woot
1 year, 6 months ago by edythemighty
XD Indeed.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
Ok. So. Disqus+Jaiku. Disqus already has a thread for each blog post on their site. You can post to the thread there or on the directly on the blog, it doesn't matter. Take that and add Jaiku, a.k.a. starting new threads this way. Interesting. Got me thinking. Amazing thread this. As for identi.ca, "open source" has been the new black for years. At least for a (very limited) group. It's that thing which you know has huge potential yet isn't in the spotlight just now (and it's not been for years). Will identi.ca make a difference? Dunno at this point. But it is clear that the guy behind it was not expecting it to be this successful this soon. Which imho is bad. It's like..oh wait, I know - Twitter. For me, the deal breaker right now (well, except for the fact that I just can not log in) is the lack of threads. Why would I leave Jaiku for something with less features? We'll see what it turns into, obviously.
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
@bvlad: And I'm sure someone will create a swanky mobile app. for it should it turn into something popular :)
1 year, 6 months ago by aksyn
@bigeclipse I agree about the belonging. The mad rush to each service is annoying (particularly as I've already said I start to look for the same people which may say more about me perhaps)
@edythemighty Participating on each service makes you A-OK as far as I'm concerned (not that you need my approval). There is nothing worse than those that just spray their digital scent everywhere though.
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
"...There is nothing worse than those that just spray their digital scent everywhere..." Well said.
1 year, 6 months ago by BigEclipse
@bvlad Never tried Disqus whatever that might be, but I like the cut of your jib in that post.
I don't think this thread and many others that I've participated in could happen on any other service other than Jaiku though.
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
@WaveyDavey001: Agreed. Only on Jaiku. Which is why, in spite of the fact that I'm spreading my digital scent everywhere, I only participate here. And Jaiku was the first microblogging service I signed up for.
Disqus is a comment(ing) platform for blogs. disqus.com. I'm not saying more, someone will at some point ask me if I work for them because I mention them so much. No, I don't. But I do like (and like to talk about) a good 2.0 service when I find one in this big ocean crowded with big whales, if you know what I mean.
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
Those who "spray their scent" are actually missing out. This is slightly heretical but if you go to every site and 'friend' exactly the same people then you'll get the same conversations everywhere. That's boring and pointless. Imagine what Jaiku would be like if every channel had exactly the same members. Ick.
The point of separating out into all these little groups is that you have different conversations and look at different facets of the same thing. @WaveyDavey001 is right that it's the particular people in a particular place who make certain kinds of conversations possible or impossible. I'd hate to lose that.
1 year, 6 months ago by adewale
@adewale: Yeah I'd hate to lose that here. ;)
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
I really wish Jaiku wasn't stuck in this frozen development state, there's so much they could do. Do fellow Jaikuers think that development has stagnated because the founders won't see any any more money from it (and so they don't try as hard to innovate)?
I find it hard to understand why we're not seeing new features every week.. (and no, I don't think the App Engine port is going to change a thing, it might mean we see less of the bird... but I didn't expect to see a bird in the first place)
1 year, 6 months ago by aksyn
@aksyn: Look here: http://bvlad.jaiku.com/presence/38875629
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
It's better to under-promise and over-deliver than vice versa
1 year, 6 months ago by adewale
@aksyn - Having spoken to @jyri a few times and also having been party to a number of conversations around this subject.. It seems to me that they are moving onto bigger/better(?) things..
Speaking to @jyri post-google buy-out is like speaking to someone who has been shown the future.. And I really don't throw the term around lightly.. Really.
You can either feed your (small) family today or you can feed the world, forever, tomorrow.
What would you do? @jyri, as you all know, is one of my few industry heroes.. And yet even I have a moment of sadness when I see how Jaiku has, for want of a better term, squandered. Potential? Bucketloads. Investment? Zero.
We wait, in hope, for the time when all will be well.. But for now? Let us waste..
Let this not however, detract from the work that is being done right now, as we speak. Yeah Jaiku has been left in the corner like johnny no mates.. But those same conversations have implied a greater good. A future where 'social themes' and 'owning your data' actually mean something.
The future looks good. But unfortunately the future is not today.
I asked the founder a long time ago what the plan was post buy-out. The thread got bumped and bumped again.. And yet still we didn't really get anything. The users need more.
I need more.
How do I know? Well for a start a wrote all of this on my N95 using T9. That's passion. Right there.
1 year, 6 months ago by whatleydude
@adewale: If I didn't agree, I wouldn't be here anymore.
@whatleydude: I need more too. What do we do? ;)
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
@whatleydude: yeh, but anyone who's met you knows that /you/ can write all that in about 3 seconds with T9 ;) Good points, I just hope the Jaiku community hasn't disbanded by the time this fabled "son of Jaiku" turns up.
1 year, 6 months ago by aksyn
@aksyn: My bet? It will have. Hope I'm wrong.
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
And that, therein, lies the nub:
Do we, as a community, hope and pray for a successor.. Or do we just lay in wait.. Gormless.. Until we get plurked or whatever.
Remember.. We are closer to the future than most of everyone we know. And yet still we cry we are hungry. We.. Us.. Those that bear the name 'early adoptor' or 'evangelist'.. You. You are the ones that are carving out this digital/social/online revolution.. We discover what's wrong now so that those that follow after us may tread without fear.
Bear that in mind and remember.
1 year, 6 months ago by whatleydude
and yes @bvlad - if I didn't agree, I wouldn't be here either. Well said mon ami.
1 year, 6 months ago by whatleydude
@whatleydude: Trust me, I know. But I still can't help desiring (or perhaps demanding) more. The hunger never goes away. You know how it is. But is there anything we can do except pray and wait? Sadly I see no VC standing next to me.
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
@bvlad: you don't need a VC - you could build Jaiku2 with App Engine, just as readily as the almighty @jyri is.
1 year, 6 months ago by aksyn
@bvlad: knowledge can be learnt my friend :)
1 year, 6 months ago by aksyn
@aksyn: Of course I'd need VC funding to build something as shitty and as successful as twitter. You just can't do that without millions of $.
On a more serious note, I would if I had any programming knowledge.
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
I''m very sad about the current state of Jaiku. Of all the microblogging sites, this is the one I've been the most passionate about. It pains me to see it neglected when there is so much potential. But you have some very good points @whatleydude, those of us caught up in all of this innovation tend to forget that it doesn't even exist yet for most of the world. I think it's just so much a part of my (mostly) daily routine now that I think everyone does it when that obviously isn't the case. :)
1 year, 6 months ago by zenith
I like threads like this, and i think it's a shame that most development happens in a vacuum and is then it's pushed out the door with a "hey we built this, deal with it" - I like the idea of identi.ca, because those who use it, who listen to (sniff?) the ether, and who are able should be able to extend it themselves for the good of everyone else. and shouldn't a platform for social networking be built out in the open by a community?
1 year, 6 months ago by aksyn
of course there's always the possibility that many hands will turn it in a big steaming turd of a platform, with a million incompatibilities and insecurities... but it's worth a shot
1 year, 6 months ago by aksyn
There was a song in Romanian back in the day that had a line I love. It was something like "we live each day with one day in advance". Some of us here are probably months if not years ahead of the mainstream, but...I honestly don't care. I don't think that wanting something to work and improve is out of line.
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
I think sometimes people lose touch with just how long it takes to build systems. I've been guilty myself of saying to someone you should just add this little feature and it will be great. Then they point out how many weeks that feature will take to build and test.
People also have this sense that any system which isn't constantly changing is being neglected. However once your system uses more 1 machine you're likely to find that it takes constant effort just to keep the whole thing running. Ask the Twitter guys or anybody who works in Operations and they'll tell you the same thing.
This is why one of the things that has always impressed me about the Jaiku guys is the remarkable level of transparency they've displayed about what they're doing and planning to do. For instance: http://mikie.jaiku.com/presence/39040029
Most teams would prefer to give other people the illusion that they're like a swan gracefully gliding over the water rather than show you that their feet are madly paddling under the surface.
1 year, 6 months ago by adewale
Getting back to identi.ca, I posted about Russ Beattie's opinion on the source code (in a word: notmadetoscale) here: http://bvlad.jaiku.com/presence/39134264. I'm linking this here since I figure more people will see it. Great read if you ask me.
1 year, 6 months ago by bvlad
@terryjr386: i've email them/him about the IM not working and the email didnt bounce. still waiting for a reply
1 year, 6 months ago by BUGabundo
i cant use http://foozik.com via OpenID.... lame
1 year, 6 months ago by BUGabundo
Well 1 day on and no one can really say anything bad. Yes it got slow, yes it isn't fully featured and yes it could do better. But yes it is open source. I love jaiku and I'm not planning jumping, (see other peoples threads), but this is Jaikus first rival. Twitter etc are no community at all, but I sense that people want this to work.
1 year, 6 months ago by WaveyDavey001
Love this thread.
1 year, 5 months ago by whatleydude
It's a good one, yes :)
1 year, 5 months ago by zenith
@whatleydude: Just re-read this and I still think a conversation like this can only happen on Jaiku, which is why I get a bit sad when people veer off to this weeks big thing.
So something may be the 'new black' today but Jaiku is Black and I'm hoping it won't fade and go out of fashion
1 year, 5 months ago by WaveyDavey001
Well said that man.
1 year, 5 months ago by whatleydude
@WaveyDavey001: Nailed it there indeed.
1 year, 5 months ago by bvlad
I just want to resurrect this conversation.
Because......
2 months, 1 week ago by WaveyDavey001
Those of you on Google Wave your thoughts on this http://beingwaveydavey.blogspot.com/2009/10/playing-with-google-wave-and-embedded.html
You need to be logged in to wave
2 months, 1 week ago by WaveyDavey001
Because...we can.
2 months, 1 week ago by adewale
@adewale: Yes it is great to resurrect a Jaiku.
I am liking the power of wave now. It still isn't Jaiku.
2 months, 1 week ago by WaveyDavey001
WOW the power of jaiku ! that is exactly one of the things i love about this place, and that makes it hard to leave :)
2 months, 1 week ago by BUGabundo
+1
2 months, 1 week ago by edythemighty
+1000
2 months, 1 week ago by cybette
It's over nine thousaaaaaaand!
2 months, 1 week ago by edythemighty
I commented to Waveydavey's blog via Disqus and that put his embed into my Wave inbox.
2 months, 1 week ago by topgold
@topgold: That really is interesting and something I didn't know Disqus would do. Are you sure that wasn't because you had clicked on the embedded wave itself? Running that experiment has been interesting as I also learnt that there is threaded conversations in Identica now (shows how long its been since I visited). It shows to me that Jaiku was really ahead of its time and that despite the enourmous popularity of Twitter people still want more. If those people just came back occasionally.
2 months, 1 week ago by WaveyDavey001